RISK, Founder of the West Coast Graffiti Movement and Street Art Icon – UNLEASHED Podcast E412

Monster Energy gets into the creative mind of street art pioneer RISK (Kelly Graval) in a live episode recorded at the legendary RISKROCK Studios compound in Los Angeles. In a candid interview, the Monster Energy Ambassador speaks on the intersection of graffiti and fine art while sharing his unique experience from the wild early days of the graffiti movement.

UNLEASHED goes live from Los Angeles with the founder of the West Coast graffiti movement and street art pioneer RISK. The winner of the 1989 World Graffiti Championship stepped on the scene at a time when street art was still wild and illegal. Known for bringing the culture of painting ‘whole car’ train wagons to the West Coast and pioneering graffiti art on freeway overpasses, RISK continues to craft influential works across a wide range of mixed media. Aside from collaborating with music bands such as Blink 182, Aerosmith, Guns & Roses, and Red Hot Chili Peppers, RISK defines the visuals of consumer products, including numerous Monster Energy drink cans. For the live podcast episode, the creator of iconic sculptures commanding six-digit price tags at auctions crafted a unique piece of art that was raffled to fans live on the air during the podcast. Enter the creative universe of RISK, where anything can happen – only on UNLEASHED!

Press the play button (and hit Like) on the new episode of UNLEASHED with The Dingo, Danny, and Brittney.

Subscribe and stay tuned for more UNLEASHED episodes. Regular editions of the show are recorded live inside Studio M at Monster Energy headquarters in Corona, California, and published bi-weekly. Also, follow @monsterenergy for updates.

Transcript

0:04

Now. That's got. Damn. Got to get better. Yeah, we got to go way better that I'm going to crack a can because we are at risk, rock. And to my right is risk. Ali Gravel. And this is your set of good. I was working on it. Yeah, yeah, I do it. All right. Nailed it. Yeah. Cool. Well, this is the drink that you designed with monster a few years back and it came in. You can get their packaging, their bedding, if you can open that up for face the camera and open it up. Look at it. What is it? It's like a subway car right there. Right? Oh, look at that. We're a train. Train, right. This is dope. Part of our juice series. But, we are at, Where in in your right. Your house. Right. Compound. Which a compound? Probably the coolest studio I've ever seen in my life. Yeah, definitely is a really. Thank you studio. Thank you. you've you've built this thing out. Wherein. What would. What is this? The paint shed. What do we call this room? Yeah, this is the paint room. This is a studio. This is where we do the messy painting. Yeah. we have another studio over there that's going to be the clean studio for, like, brushwork and stuff. But this is the one that all the paint is thrown around and we make a mess. It's the wet studio. And then do the dry studio. There you go. How about resident painter in here? For all the episodes we do with painters, graffiti artist Brittany's painted in here before I paint her, I heard, I heard she's been here. You were talking about the podcast that you had happy hour, and I was nice and toasted. Yeah. And toasty. And we were painting on this wall, and I just go up and just take two spray paint cans, and I'm just like, she was just like, okay, we're doing that. Yeah, yeah, I still have those pieces. I still have those paintings as canvases. Yeah, I see them. originally from New Orleans. Yes. And when did you move to California? wow. So seventh grade. I moved to Lake Tahoe, and then eighth grade I went to California. So Lake Tahoe, then to where in California? Lake Tahoe. You were on the Nevada side of California side? good question. I think I was on the California. I was someone I was gambling, I was right on the border because county was right there. Yeah. So I was in, casinos. Yeah, I was in, Incline Village. Yeah. You're California, so. California. Yeah. Yeah, yeah. So I was go ahead. So I was there and then I went to Manhattan Beach in eighth grade. Nice. And then Palos Verdes is in ninth grade, nice in 10th grade. And I was in LA from that point on. Yeah. And when did you stop like painting or doing graffiti. So. Oh probably la 10th grade ninth. Well see my dad, we moved all the time. So I'd go to each school like half a semester and go to a different school. So I think it was like ninth or 10th grade. I started doing graffiti as at Uni High. And this kid came from do we agree and talk about that? Yeah, this kid came from New York and I used to draw on my books and shit and table and I wrote, cursive shit. Yeah. And I, I used to draw waves and write surf all the time, and this kid's like, hey, what do you write? I'm like, I don't write. I draw pictures and say, what do you write in? I, I don't fucking write. I draw pictures. I was like, this kid's a fucking idiot. Like, I don't, I don't write, I draw pictures, and he's like, we call it writing. It's subcultural graffiti. But I'm like, what? And he took out these photos and he showed me New York trains. And I was like, whoa, that's just fucking cool. So that day I went and, I went to his hardware store and I stole, like, some cans of red and white. And I came back to my school and I just sat there like, waiting for it to get dark, staring at the school pew. Must have thought I was psycho. I just sat on the corner staring at the school. I don't think so. And then, it got like dusk. I jumped the fence and did this piece, and it was terrible. It was like the worst thing you ever saw. Like, everything. I imagine it was the opposite of that. Like, I was like, oh, it's kind of these arrows and this and that, and it was just a big blob. But the next day there was like 400 kids, but that's fucking cool. I'm like, that's cool. And like, yeah. And I was like, all right. And they just had never seen something like that. So I was hooked. And I did it every day since then. And when you're when you're painting graffiti, I mean, that's the thing that always scared me about. It's like you really, you have to get it right. So, like, when you think it's messed up, I mean, you can't really just white out. You have to let it, you know. So it was it. Where did you learn? Like where you just painting all over schools. What was your summer school? So I didn't realize that it was until. Well, yeah, until way later. That was illegal. The graffiti is the magic eraser. Like, I didn't realize that because I get all panicked about it. I was like, oh, it's fucked up now. I can't fix it. Yeah. And then years later, I'm like, oh, you just go right over that shit, you know? So it's cool. But yeah, I, I painted my school and it was like a cat and mouse thing. Like I had it wired. All my friends would come with me and we'd sit on the roof and they'd whistle when the security's coming and go this way. And then eventually I broke in the school and I painted the lockers so they couldn't buffet. I called them the Locker Rockers. And then, I just killed my school, but I was only like, do that surf there. And I was getting arrested and get in trouble on I'm. So they bus me pretty quick. And then that's when I changed my name and risk and then. Right. Yeah. Wow. I was wondering, so how did you like, did you go through a couple names before you found risk, or was it to like get away? I did, I did, so my friend wrote chance and I was like, that's the best name in the world. And now I'm like, that's my name sucks. But, I wanted that name. And I wrote, the Iroc Z came up, so I wrote Iroc is Rock Ridge Rock. And then I saw the risk board game. But I'm like, I guess risk is cool now. I love the fucking name. I is a better name ever. But that's how it happened. But yeah, I wrote all these different names for like a couple of weeks. Like the first piece on a on a California freeway color piece, actually. So I was like, is rock? And I'm like, fuck, I didn't say risk. you know, it's wild now, like living in, in LA, and being through this era where, I mean, like, I'm, I'm in the building that looks into the building. The tag. Yeah. Right. Towers. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, I look directly into it and it's like it's wild. Like driving around now and just seeing the pieces that go off and they get painted down and they go back and we live in like, I tell people now, we live in like Gotham cinema, Gotham City era. Yeah. And for painters or graffiti artists, I feel like that's like, this is the time to be living in. Yeah, I was just talking to somebody that it's. Yes, for sure, but it's scary is it's fucking scary because I'm watching all these dudes paint right now and it's like, you know, I might have slipped out of there a couple nights and been not painting and saying, it's free. Fall is fucking great. They're not like, you know, buffing, they're not arresting. But it's also election season coming up in the Olympics. So you're going to see a big crackdown. Yeah. You know and it's like a lot of people they're going to make examples of a lot of people and they're going to come down hard. So it's a little scary you know. Right. that the the building that in Miami was before that. Right. Yeah. Was that legal or illegal? I that was totally illegal. That's what started the whole thing, right? Yeah. I just didn't know if that was like a piece of Art Basel or like, that was the big. Well, everyone said it was the best thing and Art Basel is another. So I was lucky enough to hit that building early because all my boys did it and they're like, get up there. So I went up there and did it, and then the guys actually flew back here and start that one, right? So it was end of January. I flew home from X-Games and I there was like three tags off. I actually hit that video. I one of the first videos. Yeah, it's my balcony. Looks into it right. Yeah. My whole living room looks into it and I hit it. I did a photo shoot in Daytona. I came back the next day and the whole building was done. It's fucking crazy. Yeah. And that's what I was talking to people that were in the building. And then I was also I've got friends that are cops are like, fuck yeah. I had a friend show me, pictures of the building. And later that night he was like on the news, and I showed him the clip because what the fuck was that? They were filming him, and he didn't even know it. Yeah. The helicopter, they still do. Now. I don't know if they do like flybys or they do tours by it, but like, helicopters will still come in. They put fences up and it's fully like they had police there 24/7. Yeah. And, and and then they fully fenced it. and then there'll be like nights where they'll be like choppers that come in and loop it and light it. But it's not cops. And I'm like, are they just like side touring? Yeah. Which they probably are probably. All right. So a few achievements here risks face your fears to the 2018 rocket the world on June 24th, fetching, $214,000. That was, a you sold. Well, that was for an auction. That was a piece I sold in an auction. Yeah, yeah. Wow, that's really cool. I didn't, or someone sold it, I didn't, I saw it was from a gallery show. Yeah. That's it. Is that kind of mind blowing when you're doing, like, these auctions where you like, you know, because you see your own work and you're like, oh, this is worth so much to me, or I put so much time into it, but when you see that price go wild, is that like, yeah, I mean, I don't mind, it's cool. But you know, it's funny, like I've had, people come in like, you know, a painting, it's stolen. Right? And then this guy comes in and he's like, I found a storage for. So guys, they found it and I'm fucking locker. And they come and they have a gallery lady come here. And this night we did a deal, and I traded it to him for something. And then the lady right in front of me buys it for like, 100 and or some shit. And I was like, I just tell you that for like, 15 grand. Like, just like, right in front of me. They just traded to the deal, you know? Yeah, yeah. But, it's cool. I mean, it is what it is. Funny story at the Tony Hawk Foundation this year. I, like, put my hand up for a painting for a lot of money. And then another guy beat me on it, and Tony was like, dude, that thing's worth like $10. I was like, thanks for telling me. Afterwards, I put my hand up. Heck yeah. all right. Collaborations. This is pretty cool. I read this and I, I guess I didn't I never really thought about this, but you worked with the Red Hot Chili Peppers, playing 1 or 2 Aerosmith and Guns and Roses. I mean, on my list of bands, I'd say there's four of my favorite bands on that list. Yeah, that's wild. Yeah. Michael Jackson I also read to Jackson. Yeah. That's that. That was had to be early on though, That was early. So Michael Jackson I used to like. So I ran away like early on. Like when I was in high school, I ran away and, I used to go to find people like the sets and stuff, like doing graffiti, like movies. And I'd say, let me do some background graffiti for craft services just to eat and stuff. And then they got to know me. So they started hiring me to do the backgrounds, and then I eventually I did the Michael Jackson videos. My first big gig. Was it, the Way you make Me Feel? Yeah. And it was dope because they're like unlimited budget. They're like designed three streets, ones like all New York graffiti and one's gang writing and one's like, whatever you want it to be. And we're going to pick the street and then they picked a piece of each street, you know? So it's really cool. But my favorite collaboration, Aerosmith for Joe Perry and Steven Tyler, like, got the graffiti itch. Let's go. Bonnie. And I don't really know what they wanted to do because they kept hiring me. They called me like, let's go do this and that. And I'm like, so I thought, they want me to tell them about graffiti or how we do it or what we do, and they're like, I thought, they're using me to like, consult for how to launch their announcement for their new tour, but they wanted to actually go bombing for the new tour and tour. And I was like, you can't just do that. You get arrested. They will get arrested. Aerosmith. I'm like, all right, here we go. So we went bombing and we almost got arrested. But but it's true. The coffee guys get chased by the police with Aerosmith. I'm on. I'm I'm in a lot of problems at the time with the city. I'm having all these major, major issues. And, Joe Perry's like. All right, I wanted to say, let Rock rule tour coming. I'm like, dude, it's a block long. Like there's a big wall. And I'm like, bro, if the cops come, you're going to have to, you know, get the lawyers. I got to not worry about it. Cool. So I started doing the piece. Cops come in, here we go. And he goes, what's up, Joe Perry? Aerosmith. We're announcing my tour. And like, right on, they leave. I'm like, what the fuck? Yeah, yeah. Like, why is it, is that easy for me? I mean, but we did TMZ. TMZ picked it up and they called this and they're like, hey, did you really go painting with Joe Perry and this? And I'm telling all the stories and they're they're pictures. All the buildings. We hit the stuff. And then the detectives came in there. They tried to bust me, and it was so cool, because the one guy that they tried to get the press charges is like, yeah, I'm, I'm a pretty big fan of Aerosmith. I know how to get in such a risk. If I want to paint my building, I'll call him. Yeah, I'm not going to press charges. Wow. Yeah, you got lucky, dude. There was a time there. Like, I remember when I met Revoke and Ratner and those guys remember, we were at that show and nobody's on paintings or at least workers being party. Yeah, and nobody bid on these paintings. And I watched this dude spent like, a quarter million dollars on his own paintings. It's like, that's I mean, I was like, oh, that makes sense. You don't want your value in your painting to go down. Yeah. and then I also met revoke at that time. Yeah. And that's when I like then really understood like how much the police had revoked. And I don't know if you know this story, but I brought revoke to Australia. We were doing an event out there, Haitian. And then the event fell through and he ended up tagging Melbourne. So good one, sir. And then there's some really good ones. And then he went to get on the plane and they picked him up at the airport. Yeah. And he was put in jail. Yeah. I was the fucking person that brought him down. Yeah. Hell yeah. Well, it didn't help when he came out. He had his glasses on. They go. Do you have any more shoes? Yes, very more so. And they're like, he was like an Australian legend. Like he was on every news channel. It was like, it's huge. So we were getting like a lot of problems after that because he was on probation. So they kept nailing him all the time and they kept harassing me because I was with those shoes. And I was doing a commercial on the Texas shop on set. I was making a book. They'd go in there and tell the guy, why are you making a book? This guy's a fucking piece of shit. Like, there was this. It was gnarly, gnarly, gnarly, gnarly. And then the ACLU actually got behind me, and then they kind of backed off. I got a question. So how do you like as you get more famous within your tagging? Right. How do you balance out, like staying out of trouble? Because as you get more fame and more popular, it's easy to identify, right? Because you're. Yeah. So using your tag, I just really couldn't paint in L.A for a long time. It was just impossible because they were just going to nail me. Like, it's like, you know, I don't want to. I want to skip that question a little bit right now, but that's totally. Well, like, I mean, do you like, kind of like mold into a different thing where you start selling your work and that kind of like, yeah, changing your, you know, output in a way. Well, I think for me, you know, I, I saw my work really early, so slick. And I won the world championship in 1987 or something. 89, 89. Thank you, thank you. Well, and because of that, we had collectors buying our shit. Yeah. So I was introduced to selling my artwork very early, so I always did it, but I was always doing illegal graffiti too at the same time. So I was in both. And it was like everyone was like, what's the crossover? There's never a crossover. I just couldn't paint in L.A. so when I traveled to go do shows or with my previous company and stuff like that, I would paint. So every time I went to city, I'd bomb. Like, yeah, like, it'd make the paper like the front pages of paper. Like, if he gets close to town, hits the freeways, and then, you know, you start doing you find other ways to paint that, you know, under the radar kind of thing. You know, like, I'm also think I also think, though, that the way that the graffiti movement has changed and especially from something I notice of you, is you've created a style to do murals and so you can still be bombing, but you're you're putting your art, and people want you to paint their buildings because there's, it's so beautiful and vibrant and the butterflies and, and I think that that's a really kind of a good, I guess, buffer to where when you want to go and, you know, do what you came from, you know, do the graffiti. But also, I mean, you have a building in Manhattan Beach that I love. Oh, yeah. The gallery. Oh, nice. Yeah, yeah, it's still up there. It's always yeah, you could always recognize your work. And I think that that's where, you know, you guys have changed the game and you can just paint murals. Yeah, well, it's. See, my graffiti is different than my gallery. Art is different than my murals. My, my public murals are like colorful murals. my gallery says mixed media. My graffiti is my graffiti. It's only recently sculptures and my sculptures are found objects. And it's only recently that they've kind of been crossing over and coming together. yeah. Yeah. It's funny. So there's I think two things. I feel like a you didn't get in this first to be a job or make money. I don't feel like I feel like when you start a painting, you just want to paint. Yeah. There was no like, oh, this is going to be my. But, you know, everyone always says, and I hate like this question. There was like, did you ever expect me to go? And I'm like, fuck yeah. Yeah. I mean, obviously, you know, we dedicate our life to this. I always expected to be in a gallery and aspire to be in a museum. You know, I dedicate my life to something. So I wanted to be decent enough to be celebrated for that. So I always expected that. Yeah. Did I ever expect to be very successful? I don't know, I expected to get by for sure. Yeah, but I didn't expect to get a lot of stuff that I got with that. Yeah. yeah. It's got to feel pretty good to like, take, you know, this in the street art, where at that time, people probably weren't like, oh, this is a gallery thing or whatever, and stick with it to the point where you get to see it turn to where people actually appreciate. You get to see a bunch of times, because when we first did it, no one saw it. It was really cool. Yeah, that's fucking cool. They'd come outside. You're painting really? That's cool. Then the tagging came. They were like, they wanted to kill us. I then the museum show came as cool. Yeah, it's just like a cycle. It just keeps going. Right. But I feel like you guys, it's only recently that graffiti artists have been, like, respected by the public. And like, everything moving forward, I feel like there was like it was around. I don't know, I can't believe I'm wrong here. When Shepard Fairey did the Obama painting and then ended up in that, and then that became so big, and then that there was, you know, a turning of graffiti or graffiti artist or artists that were in the streets that are now being your art is then being put in the galleries and being sold for lots of money. That's given you guys becoming like, fine art. Yeah. Is that is that wrong by saying, well, no. But I think what happened was, you have people like Roger Gassman and Jeffrey Deitch that did art in the streets and be on the streets and stuff like that, and when the mainstream sees it in a museum, all of a sudden they associate it with value. And I remember the L.A. times did an article on me at the time of Art of the streets, and they're like basically saying, kind of like overnight success. I'm like, yeah, I've only been doing this for 26 years at the time, you know, and I own it. And the same dickhead that wrote it had criticized me for years on different art blogs and stuff and didn't even, like, realize the same person. Wow. But anyway, but yeah. Yeah. Wow. And then we got into, like, this whole big thing. We actually ended up being, you know, we get along now, but, yeah, I think when the museums dictate that that's when I. But and also, you know, Shepard Fairey doing the Obama thing. what that did was catapult a whole group of young artists the first time in hundreds of years that we had such a young demographic loving art. Yeah. And people realized they can make a difference with art, and they have a voice, and that's the whole thing. And I think that's why graffiti is the most important art form. It's a hand, a medium to a surface. The last hand to medium is a surface art form. It goes digital after that, but it's also because the young people found their voice through art. Yeah. You know, it's giving the opportunity. Like you said, if you can do it, I can do it. Now we're being exposed to all these incredible new up and coming artists that are absolutely beautiful and beyond the streets. What Roger has done, it's. Yeah, go and walk through those halls. It's incredible. Really? Yeah, yeah. They're so good at those books, too. sculpture, art. When did you get into sculpture? So, but, art in the streets are beyond the streets. One of those down the streets, down the streets. I did my first major sculpture and it was the shark, and I did it for Roger show. And, I wanted to pay homage to Damien Hirst, who's one of my favorite artists. And I did an urban version of his shark, the chance to be a cop car and to make it to be a shark, because I was reading up some stuff and he said, the world's biggest predator was, was, the great white shark. And I was like, If I'm doing an urban version, the world's biggest parade is a cop. So I took the cop car and I sliced in half like he slices all his stuff, right? Yeah, I remember seeing that. And then. So that was my first shark sculpture. Was that cop car sliced in half? And then I came back and revisit the found object. sharks. And that gets into me paying homage to the Ferris Gallery, who's a group of artists prior to me in the 60s that I absolutely loved. They inspired the hell out of me. Like, that's my whole being is to continue dialog with those guys. And keyholes was one of the guys that did a lot of sculptures of found objects. But you have Billy Al Benson, you have, Ed Ruscha, you have Dennis Hopper, you have, fact some of them. Right. Where is the car? And was this is it still there? I donate it to, the Valley Relic Museum. Yeah. Where's the valley relics? It's in the valley. It's so cool because they have this van. You know, you can go there smoking joint and super close in, and they have the car there, and they have all this cool shit, like all the first BMX bikes and just really cool shit. Yeah. All right, we got to go there. Yeah. It's dope. let's talk about when you started, third Rail Street where I came in, I saw this logo. And for those of you that don't know or being Danny, come from a snowboarding background. And I looked at and it resonated. And then I didn't say anything. And then we talked about we talked about it and then you were like, yeah, I did the Moro Snowboard designs. And I was like, that's a logo I looked at since I was a kid. Yeah, they they private labels like snowboards. And that's how we started with them. And we did a bunch of stuff with them as good stuff. Who did that? That's your drawing. And then you come up with the name? No, I came with the name and I took the Arizona, Sun Devils logo. Yeah. And you know, that was back in the time of streetwear. I just stole logos and stuff and put that on there now and then. A cartoon was actually you got to draw your own devil, and we're at some restaurant. He actually do that for me on a napkin. So cartoons do that? devil, the original devil. So what what inspires you when you have these projects? I mean, I know as an artist you can this get inspired from other, you know, signs or whatever? Is there something specifically that you lean towards when you are assigned a project or you want to do a project or you just kind of let it, how'd your creativity get sparked? I don't know, you know, there was such a period of time like the butterflies came because my kids, yeah, you know, they're really young and stuff like that. And that happened. And then I just kind of find these veins and then go with it. Like, the butterflies had so much meaning to me because they're temporary and our art's temporary. And, a friend of mine said, from an art to monarch, because I grew up in the the punk rock scene in Venice Beach and, and all these things, I just kind of find veins and go with it. But, you know, music, a lot of music. and I'll just like, look at something and find one aspect of it and I'll just go from there. Yeah, well, you have to write. You just have to, like, trust that instinct. Trust that gut. I mean, yesterday I was painting and stuck, and I just had to sit for five seconds. And then it goes, you know, like when you feel stuck, that's as soon as something breaks through. I don't paint small. So painting this was like, a good warm up challenge because I hate painting small. But, before you guys got here, it changed the whole thing. You changed the whole thing? What was it? Before I show you a picture of it? Like, I just I hated the K and everything because this piece was originally drawn to go on this huge wall like this. And when I shrunk it down, just kind of weird. So interesting. Just change it. Yeah. I was wondering that, like, so how often? Like, because obviously they go up and then, you know, either they disappear. But do you look at some of your early work or like pieces where you're like, oh, I wish I can just go back and redo that right now? Everything I was thinking this, really, I have a book. Roger Gasman did my book and I was like, see, this is all shit. It's crap. And he's like, dude, it's not a fucking art book. It's an autobiography. I'm like, fuck that. I don't put art. And he's like, you're not ready for our book yet. We gotta tell the story first and then we do an art book. So I we're working on an art book now and I can't wait. But even now he's like, well, we're only gonna put 30 of the new. But what do you mean? He's like, it's right now we're just transitioning to that. And the next book would be the artwork, you know? But that's funny because like, I've seen it before with great. even with, like, someone like stash, I got to hang out with him in New York quite a bit, but, like, great. But you guys are like, go over your own piece. Like, instead of just going next to it or couple down, you almost just redo your own one. Yeah. It's like I almost erase it and then just put it back up as opposed to like more and more and more. Yeah, it's a lot better, better, better. I was at, Rock Fest with monster last month or something. I did a piece and I walked away, and I look back in the piece and there's something I don't know what it was, but they were like, oh, cool, the pieces don't get the photos. And I walked in and I started redoing the whole piece, and I mean, what the fuck? You just do another one. Let me quick give him a heart attack. Yeah. who is some of the people you looked up to growing up when? Oh, like like like like inspired and inspired you as a kid? art wise? Yeah. Oh, man, there's so many. But you have to understand, like, I met, Keith Haring. wow. At Art center when I was younger, and I was kind of. I was on my way with art, and he was so influential to me. And it wasn't so much his art. It was what he did with his art. And I admired it so much, and I. And I was like, I want to be traveling one day and doing murals and meeting all kind of cool people and talking to people that like, so that inspired me. Like, and it wasn't like his style of art is necessarily inspiring to me, but like what he did with it. Warhol, The Fun Factory, bring all these people together, creating all the time, socializing through your art. Super inspiring to me. yeah, there's so many different layers to that. Michael Angelo, sculpture painter. rebel. You know, again, not my kind of art, but super influential to me. Michael Heizer. The don't people don't really know a lot about him, but I'm super inspired by his early art, and he's known for, like, Levitated Mass and all these big sculptures and shit, but, like, I'm like, oh, the fucking poster did the Olympics and everyone's great at running. But what did you do in Olympic stuff? I saw a bunch of people got involved in that. Were you involved? I did they approach you? I did in 2011. I did it in London. Right. It was really great. I did a proxy for L.A., though. No, I saw some weird I'm not going to say names, but I saw some weird people about, like, how did they get to do that? Well, I think you can submit it like, think, because I got the yeah, I guess they did a picture and they send you an application. Okay. But yeah, I'm going to do a mural or something. You know we releasing today was the Paralympics second Paralympics just started yesterday. Yes. We're releasing a print. Say our friend Tommy posting is in a wheelchair. He comes in and paints on the. He paints with the wheels of his wheelchair. Sick. So we took the wheels and we made the Olympic rings and we're releasing that today. Yeah, I we got a question here from Chris 256. Do you have any digital artists that inspire you? Also, what do you think of 3D printing? let's start with 3D print, because I just had a meeting yesterday with 3D printing. Now they're printing with stainless steel. It's fucking mind boggling. Wow. Like printing with stainless steel is fucking crazy for that one to happen. It's fucking crazy. So they're making houses with these fucking printers? Yeah, yeah. It's crazy. Yeah. I've seen just like that plastic I saw in Texas a dude. So with the plastic you could do 3D printing color now. So I wasn't really into toys because I never thought they could get the color right. I don't want to hand painted. I want to change the colors. Now, they could actually just print in color. So it's crazy. They can print 3D printing in stainless steel. So that's crazy. So I'm totally into that. Totally working on that. And the other question was digital art. Yeah, it wasn't the same question for the same person. I don't know anything about it. So one of my biggest regrets is not learning how to use a computer when the computers can tell a I'm. There was, Tower Records and Nana's shoes in Santa Monica, and they both had art department. It's really cool art departments. A lot of my friends worked in there. We used to go steal art supplies and all that stuff forever, but they had the first computers I saw come to LA. The Max, and I remember my friends using them and I was like, that's fucking stupid. I can draw faster and dumb thing. And I never used them. They went on to be masters at them and they obviously became a lot quicker and stuff. And I think that if I learned how to use a computer, I'd probably be a little further along. But, so I'm not really the person to ask on that. I'm not really familiar with digital art. I see, it's cool, I can't relate. I struggle to turn on a computer, so we're good there. Banksy. Banksy's dope. I've done a couple things to make it so. You know what's so funny? This is you're going to laugh about this. So there was a time there where Banksy followed three people and one of them was tall. Really tall. Kevin. And I was like, he's hoping that this man, like anybody can. Yeah. I was like, is this weird dude that I like bet on this? That was giving away their style watches that would hang out the front of DC. Emma Stone, Aaron Levant, who became my one of my best friends. I literally was like 21 hanging out with him in LA. And now Banksy followed three people and Cole was one of them. I was like, you want to hear a great Banksy? Yeah, so for exiting the gift shop, they have me. They want me to come in and announce the movie and stuff like that for the screening, but also they want me to be on the red carpet outside and some the limo comes and I guess, a big moving truck is going to hit the limo or vice versa. Something's going to happen. It's going to be big commotion. And then I'm going to start painting the truck, this box truck. And then as the celebrities come down the red carpet, I show them how to spray paint and tag the truck. The truck breaks down on the way to the fucking thing so it never shows up. So we're all sitting there in the limo, sitting there and like, fuck it. So I start bombing limo, wondering, what are you doing? And I start hitting the limo, and I do this piece on the limo, and I step on Oreos and Willie, to all these photographers that are friends of mine, and they're nudging everyone away from me, like keeping all the people away from me, and they're calling the police and you get all crazy. And then, Banksy's people come out there and they're like, we didn't say anything about it. And then someone's like, are you going to let them get arrested in defeated? And they were like, fuck. Now they got on the phone, they bought the limo on the spot. And the limo driver is a total dick. And they're like, yeah, don't worry about it. We bought the limo and he goes, all right, well, I'm gonna to get home. They go start walking, motherfucker. Wow. And then, they shut me in the side door and the cops came. Everything and everything is cool. Yeah, I got a limo now. I don't know, what is. What do you think? And, how graffiti has changed over time. In your opinion? Oh, wow. How graffiti has changed over time. Well, so many ways. So I started painting in 1983 and we didn't have anything to look at except New York subway and, until about 85. That was like the Bible, subway, art and all that stuff. And every style I feel is derivative of New York anywhere in the world. It's like all you saw was graffiti that looked like New York. Yeah, 85, 87 people started doing graffiti and they started molding into their own styles. Like, you know, now London has a style and LA, especially hardcore, developed like they looked at a lot of the writing and stuff like that, and they started developing these blocky styles and sharp edges and different colors and stuff like that. so if you ask the question how that changed, that changed like that for that reason. But if you ask about now because of the internet, because of cell phones, and because of, you know, we had we're pen pals. Yeah, we had to write and send photos to each other and take two months to actually see a piece that was done, you know, two months ago. Yeah. Now, within two seconds, like did. So you see this great melting pot of graffiti. The style's elevated to a level. It's just fucking beyond belief. And there's so much of it. So, you're losing a lot of that style per, region, so to speak. And you're just getting these mega styles. And what would you, like, if you had any advice for up and coming, you know, people who want to start graffiti, you want to start art. Is there something that you would maybe have wanted to know yourself at a young age or something you would tell others? Yeah, I mean, I keep it real similar, keep on keepin on. Like, I mean, that applies to it. I mean, it it sounds basic, but it applies to fucking everything. Yeah. You know, if I were to start and, you know, my teachers and my parents told me, you know, to graffiti, I would never be the person I am today. And I just, you know, I do something to the point where you go through, you do it so much as painful, and you do it to the point where you love it. You just keep going, going, going, going. And yeah, yeah, keep on, keep on. how did you feel when you realized this was changing from a hobby to something you could make a good living from? it was totally cool because all I wanted to do is paint my ass off and just get paid. And paint was fucking rad. And I was very lucky, man, because I was earlier in, in the Hollywood scene and everything. So graffiti is getting popular. Companies wanted to use graffiti and I convinced them to do it, make it real, make it authentic. Let me write risk. So when I did all those backs, I saw these movies and Michael Jackson stuff. I was writing risk. Yeah. So I was very lucky I didn't, you know, later after me, people had to come in and start writing corporate names and stuff like that. How do you feel about doing commissions? Is it kind of like take the that creative edge away a little bit stressful? Do you know, I'm fortunate enough to be able to pick and choose my commissions. So that's the big thing. Yeah. And then they're all solid people and good companies that I get behind. So if you're picking what you do you get behind the company. There's really no problem. It's just, you know, there's a certain period of time sometimes people have to do things that they don't do, and that's the problem. Yeah. So when we did the Tops project together. Yes. How did you like that? Totally out of my wheelhouse. But I loved it. I think I loved your cards. They're cool, but, like, I didn't know. I'm not, like, a really illustrative artist. Yeah. I was like, what the fuck am I going to do? But then when I figured out to do them this big and shrink them down, yeah, it was cool. So we still have all of those, like because I'm the same way I paint bigger. So I was painting all of the cards and like I was painting actual portraits and I just have like tons of portraits of baseball players. I'm like, okay, I don't know what I'm to do with these, but I have it. Yeah, yeah. It was. I love that project, but it was like the the crossover to a different crowd, you know, like that doesn't necessarily see my artist. It was really cool too. And it was the perfect time because we were doing it, what, 2021. So it was like right at that, like during Covid, we were all kind of locked in and gave us some perfect. Yeah, I remember I came here for Thanksgiving and we were talking about it. Yeah. For the first drop. Yeah. All right, Noah Jones, what's the biggest piece you've ever done. And did you enjoy it because you said here is you struggle doing small pieces. This is not a small piece to me. This wouldn't fit in most bedrooms. But you're used to doing giant pieces. What's the biggest one you've ever done? Sudbury, Canada. I did this hospital and it was the biggest mural in Northern America. And I did it with monster. Yeah. And we we we had 12 days to do this fucking thing. I was like a thousand gallons of paint, and it was a fucking nightmare. Like they stole our fucking equipment. Like who stole your equipment? We don't know. They stole like, everything. Like five times. Wow. I was asking the festival guys up here. Festival? What's up? Up here? Festival. Great, guys. But I was like, what's up man? Why is the fucking. What's happening? Oh, we have a security guard, like one time. Screw you guys. I got tired, so I hid the trailer in the bushes over there and took a nap. And I'm like, that was smart. The guy clean up the whole fucking trailer because it's in the bushes. You know, I remember like it was just a fucking shit show, but, like, we got it done. Loved it. It was crazy. you know, we got there. I had to go. I have a high lift certificate, and I had to go get a different one for Candlelight Lives certificate. It's like you can run lifts, big machinery, big machine or some OSHA kind of stuff that they have different. They have the majesty there or something. And it was crazy. And, we did all that and some stuff that we can't talk about that we did that we shouldn't have done. Yeah, right. Cool. We got it done. while we talking about stuff we shouldn't have. You made history, and, the first Los Angeles graffiti writer whose work ran a subway car in 1988. How dangerous was the graffiti back then? And obviously, that was illegal. Yeah. So that was, any. It might be a little earlier than I. I don't know what it was right around the time. And it was the last of the running graffiti trains in New York, like they were getting really clean and everything. And I graduated high school and I hitchhiked to New York to do to paint trains. And I went, my friend Dante, and, he's familiar with graffiti and all this stuff, and he's like, they're not really going to be receptive to you. They don't like the L.A. is something you don't say you do graffiti. So we went to his friend's house. Who is Reese, and I walked in the minute I walked in, I was like, guys, you graffiti? And he's like, okay, fuck you. So he left me there, and Reese and those guys were so awesome to me. Ghost Venkat Reese, I believe Wayne, I met all these legendary dudes that took me out painting every night. I got to paint trains and it was fucking just amazing. But it was crazy because, you know, we're going to Jamaica, Queens. We're going to all these different places where we had situations and I had to be adapt to the situation. They knew the situation. So I just kind of followed them. But it was crazy interesting. Like, I mean, when you when you're painting trains in New York, are you in the like, are you in the tunnels? Are you outside? Like, where are you tunnels, layups, etc.. You know, you know, that was it. The most dangerous graffiti I did was L.A. by far. You know, the tunnels are cool. Once you get there, you cool. You gotta look out for guards and stuff like that. But like LA, the first person you ever passes to here, right? Yeah. Yeah, I did a it was a train overpass on the, on the 110 or whatever it was. So as a kid from Australia when I first came to the US, like I would never seen graffiti on signs like that. And it's kind of a trip, like you're like, how the fuck do they get up there? How the fuck? Yeah, get up there. So I shimmied across this one, you know? But later on, like Wisconsin, they're my crew. They started. They the ones that really coined it. Heavens, they coined that name and everything. They would go up there and get hired, sit up there and watch cars and shit go by and everything, and we start painting them, and they started hitting the back of them and stuff like that. But, that's how it all started. We, you know, when I first did that overpass, it was fucking really scary because I was shimmying across and the wood was all rotten and it was falling down. I never forget, like I was, I wasn't scared of getting caught or anything like that, but I was like, damn, this is how my life ended. I thought, the wood is going to go crash through a car and kill somebody. I was gonna go to jail for, like, murder, you know? That's what I'm thinking, you know, because the wood's falling into the freeway. It was crazy. My next question on that is, is like, so in some of these overpasses that I see, are you guys sometimes spraying upside down? You're always trying to find a spot. You've got to basically shimmy find a spot to put your feet. Yeah. And then try and go out as far as you can. Yeah. I mean, it's you know, I'm not you know, the guys that are now doing the creation of the guys repelling like Rams and all those guys and they're like, right. Yeah. Those are that's fucking nuts. You know, that's like, talk about graffiti hasn't changed. Take the next level. All the shit that you think of when you're a kid, like, we have to Jetsons right? Oh there's gonna be a cell phone. Oh there's going to be a when you answer door, you can see someone all the stuff and they have it right. And then yeah, Amazon is shipping stuff like they have it. So when we're kids doing graffiti like, man, oh I want to repel from something catch tag like now they have it. You know, it's like wow. So it's kind of crazy. Danny, you have a question? Yeah. I was wondering, like, besides, like LA in New York, what are some of the other, like, kind of capitals of graffiti in different styles? wow. Germany was big for a long time. Yeah. I think everyone kind of big. Italy, I mean, they were hitting the trains for their trains. Ran forever. it's just, I don't know, it's. I think everyone has their own time and era and comes and goes. I think, Places to me that are just. I don't know if they're graffiti capitals, but Barcelona loves to go paint in Barcelona. I used to go there myself to paint. Every year in Barcelona, I just go and just find little nooks and crannies and paint on enough. And you never really saw them. But that was like my space, my place to go back when we were getting into trouble or vogue and stuff like that. I would just fucking jump to Barcelona for a week or two and just go paint. I'll just go do it over there. Yeah, yeah. Is there anywhere like you'd like to kind of go any places you'd like to kind of hit in the future? That would be cool. Or cities that like haven't been it's awesome. Summer cities. It's, you know, the Hollywood sign. That's been my dream forever. I went up there, I mapped it out. I did all this stuff. People have hit it. No one's ever really hit it. Like, hit it and hit it like, gone. I want to letter. I want to do this. Yeah, the whole thing. I want to do the sign. Everyone's because you make a phone call, they'll work on that. Like I thought so. But you know, we tried. I had a lawyer trying to write code. Didn't you have to see Owen? Didn't you have to pay to keep it up or something? If I remember correctly, it's been a while. It's privately owned by an organization, but there's no fucking way. So we actually thought about, like, getting in the helicopter and getting these cannons I could spray. Like, the color was, like, safe. And my lawyer is like, look at about how much jail time I get and everything. We're trying to figure all that out. Like if we split up the jail time between all five of us. Yeah, we can make this guy almost like, picture, like a mission impossible. What, like Tom cruise is flying by boat, painting everything. Hey. Yeah. If you've got a connection to Tom, Tom can make it happen. Yeah. My friend Rafi. Did Rafi side on it? Like back in the 80s. His band was the Rafi, and he's the one who taught me how to do it. And so he went all and stole all the sheets. And they sewed up all the sheets they got on top of these, rolled them down so they had black sheets and white sheets to make the letters. So I was going to do something like that, and I was gonna paint on the sheets and everything was going to say risky with. And then, you know, people started hitting and stuff like that, and it got hot and that security. And so we spent so many days up there getting high and shit, scribbling, tagging and stuff and never painted it. I'm like, what the fuck did you? Because people have done things over time. Like somebody dropped, a lettering on it. So it said we'd, we actually know a guy who's a little loopy that I grew up with in Australia. AJ Williams, very, he'll probably see this at some point. He's probably watching right now. he was grew up I grew up snowboarding with him and his youngest sister, but he was like a tagger in Australia or whatever. and he did some events with this guy was Looney Tunes, but he actually it's is probably, I don't know, 20 1516. He hiked up and dropped this like crazy white sign, like hiked up at like from like 11 p.m. and it took him till like 4 or 5 a.m. and he dropped this like crazy white sign next to it. And all the years. And he did it by himself. I never really there's only been a few things that I've seen. There was the holly weed. Yeah. for 28. Yeah. Everyone saw. Yeah. How did they do that? They just papered it. So if I remember correctly, he was super fucking lucky. Did it in the rain. So the motion checks have been going off and they weren't paying attention because of the rain, right. Yeah. And then he backed up in, like, this crazy canvas up, up from the bottom too. It took him six, seven hours. And then it was there. And then somebody went and took it down. But they're the only two people I've ever. yeah. We thought about, projection mapping it and doing all kind of stuff that's digital. There you go, there you go. There's one, as you get, like, bigger and you've, like, your name is kind of gotten more out there is they're like copycat painters. Like, have you ever seen anyone tag your tag? You're like, wait, that's me? Yeah, I see a lot of that. Just add a letter or just kind of. Will they kind of do the same? No. Listen, I totally get it. You know, people I, I'm, I'm blessed. I'm grateful. I think it's it's it's people paying homage. It's amazing. You know, that's that's totally cool I get it. You know, we all emulated people growing up, stuff like that. it's just some people take it to another level and, you know, and I don't even criticize them. It's like, cool, but like, don't DM me like, what's up, bro? We were at the Pentagon. I'm like, **** you. It's like, you know, like if like, good enough. Look there. Like, you know, I get phone calls like, hey, man, I saw this. Look, I got a bad day. Haha. I didn't do that, ****** Yeah, you had a bad day. You know, going back to DMing, how much is it changed? Like when you started doing this? There was nothing. It was film cameras, like a Polaroids. Then it was digital videoing. Yeah. You know for us that was like the that of snowboarding. It was like just photos magazines. When we did our first films, it was 16 millimeter. So like we would film a whole year and then you would have no if you got the shots until you went into the film room, and then the movie comes out a year later and then digital, and then now we're in this era. How much is that changed? Like blowing up spots, doing what you do, hot spotting people like it's it's got a fucked up your will a lot. Oh completely. But it's, it's, it's, you know, it's there's good and bad right. Because it's, it's made the level to such another level that it would never be at this level without social media. Yeah. Or cell phone shit like that. So you got to love it because it's, it's push the art to another elevation. so it's, you know, it's there's good bad with everything. You can't have good without bad and vice versa. You gotta adapt. Like there are people that, I'm 38, and there are people that look at the way I live, and it's, like, confusing to them, right? Yeah, but these people are still living like we did 20 years ago. Oh, yeah. So it's like it's confusing to me, but it's confusing to them where I've always I've always adapted and tried to understand what's coming next or what the next trend is or how it's going to go. It's like you look at the young kids now, it's crazy. And like, I was talking to people that are out in the train yards the other night. It's not just one kid. Every single kid now is. We're in baggy pants. It doesn't define your genre, what music you listen to. It's just right. Every kid under the age of 18 right now is wearing baggy pants. It's just. It's funny how you don't understand things like my my kids or something like that. Listen to a song is punk rock. I'm like, that's not fucking punk rock. And they want to argue with me. I'm like, I'm not going to. But like, you just don't understand shit. Like, I ran away from graffiti. My dad's like, what's the big deal? They're like, listen, if you give me cancer, I'm like, later. He's like, oh, you think you're man? I'm like, yeah, he's all right. Make sure you home every Friday for dinner. I'm like, okay, cool. And I check in every Friday. And I ran away and I just, you know, you don't understand. People that look at graffiti don't understand how someone can dedicate their life to this thing. They and they have no clue how much people are doing graffiti. Like, you know, my peers, my crew, my people are out there every fucking night putting in work to people. It's amazing if you think about it. You know, that's wild. so about, like, being so dedicated to something and sticking with it for a while. can you kind of, like, walk us through the process of you being knighted in Italy and what that was about? Because that's a pretty that's one of those giant achievements things. If you say, do you ever think this would happen? No. Fuck no. No. Right. I never expected to be. Not in fact. No, never. so Prince Medici came here. he's an artist. He's an art collector. He wanted to come by the studios working with the gallery. serve them rear gallery. They used to be here, I think, in Canada. and they made this point for him to come through. He came through. It was one of those days when there was a lot going on here. We were barbecuing and partying and all kind of stuff. I think some guys were working on some motorcycles, some guys were painting skateboards, and we're painting in the sand. And he was just like blown away. He's like, this is fucking cool. He was. I paint, skateboard. Soon he took a skateboard. I used, I built motorcycles to and he shows motorcycle, which was not a motorcycle. It's one of those moped three wheelers or you know. Yeah. So. So this one. I'm sorry. I'm not making fun of you. Kind of. You, So what is the process? And be ignited. So we become friends. So he stays here the whole time, and and he starts calling me and text me. He's like, man, I can't get over. You can't handle this. He's like, you're like a, a knight. And I'm like, what's that? And he's the way he's explaining it with this broken English, like he can I call me like, Robin Hood. I mean, what do you think I rob from the rich and gives the poor, you know, you help out a lot of people, and all of a sudden. And then he goes, the plight of the night, and he's telling me all this stuff that I'm not really paying attention to. And he keeps saying he's going to get me a knight. I'm like, yeah, whatever. And he goes, well, I have to go see the Pope. And I have to, you know, I'm allowed to X amount of people a year this night. And I'm like, is this real? And then so let me talk to the Pope about, you know, I don't know what they do, but I don't know what they do. But I guess he's got a whatever it is. So, long story short, I'm like, well, soon the tickets and he sends tickets for the whole family. And I'm like, Holy shit, I'm getting knighted. So I go to, Rome and everything. And it was the most amazing experience in my life because they have a church, this Medici church, that's like where Michelangelo Studio is. Wow. So it was this whole studio, and there's a tunnel that goes from there to Sistine Chapel, always to paint. So they're showing me all this shit stuff. Sorry. And they're like, you could paint his wall. And I'm like, no way, man, I'm not going to touch the secret. I go to the hotel. I'm like, what am I thinking? Fucking what? So next day I go. And they must have been thinking overnight. What are we thinking? He's not going to paint the wall. So they set up an easel and I got to paint the studio, which was just as cool for me. And it overlooks the city now. Used to overlook vineyards. And it takes me in there. And the priests all sleep in this room. this dorm, that's a little weird. And there's a statue of a bust and they go, This is Michelangelo. made this bust of the lady who's having an affair with the Sistine Chapel. And I'm like, oh, it's like ancient porn. And they go, yeah, the priests are like, yeah. And I'm like, as I'm touching the breast. It's weird. Just felt, did it have nipples? I don't remember. Not detailed, not detailed, but, anyway, so I got to do all this crazy shit touching Michelangelo's, and it was the. I just got to touch, like, everything I have, the Sistine Chapel they have here in a smaller version. He's like, touch it. I'm like, I don't want to touch it. There's certain things you can touch. Yeah. That's good. I mean, you you lost me. When the priest are all sleeping in the room together, I even more on that because getting to, like, see, you know, Michelangelo studio and stuff. Is there any, like, kind of famous artists, like, if you could bring someone back with a magic spell and get to do an art piece with them besides Michael over, who would it be? It'd be Michelangelo. Michelangelo? It has to be because, you know, he was breaking in the quarries to carve, so he wasn't learning. Few years. He was graffiti arts of his time, breaking into the marble quarries and that's wild to think about. So, I mean, yeah, you know. Wow. So he had the same start and chance, right. A lot of those guys, you know, I think he ran away from home too. And dad wanted to invite him every Friday I think so. I'd bet my life on it. Yeah I'm there too. Brittany, do you have some lost things to close up with? Well what is next for you? Rest. What is next? I get asked that a lot and I don't know, it's a good finale question. It's a good friend. Yeah. I, you know, life's a hell of a ride. Yeah. And I think if you know what's next, the is kind of going to be over. Yeah. So I don't ever know what's next. I'm blessed enough to be able to pick and choose projects as long as it's great projects to come. And I, I pick great project. Keep going. So I don't really know what's next. I'm working on the book babies. That's definitely this is the baby. The babies. Definitely next. That's definitely a baby Zeppelin. Definitely next Zeppelin. that's, Next. We're finished this compound after ten years of building it. That's done. we have a gallery, a new gallery down the street. Yep. And, a new book with Roger Gasman. Shout out to Roger, Roger, Roger. And then we have some toys dropping. And then of the year love toys and some shows. We have a show in Napa Valley, Hong Kong, New Zealand and a couple other places. All right. Real quick question right here. What advice would you give to a young artist who is having a hard time gaining traction exposure? That's from Ricky Rialto, man. Just keep on keepin on. Like there's no easy way. Yeah. You know, just just do everything you can and just keep doing it. And cream rises, you will be noticed. Your effort was sorely noticed. Yeah. That's true. I think it's consistency. You know, like you have to be consistent in your work, even if maybe it's not your favorite piece. You have to keep doing it, keep posting it. And I think that that's the problem sometimes with social media and artists because artists are very we're internal creatures, right. Like we're we like to go inward. So it's hard for us to express ourself and put your stuff out there for people to criticize. There's a ton of work doing it. Yeah, a ton of work. I looked at and I'm like, I don't like that at all. And after I saw a million times, like, that's pretty cool. Yeah. Like later down the road, like I guess you start to like, look at details and appreciate it. Like, oh, I didn't notice that. I didn't know that. I didn't know that. I know I meant that, you know, 100%. That's. I see you got a pen here. I got up I used to love these kids. So this was my tag growing up. It was sniper. Sniper for. It doesn't work. Just give it a little tap down to get some ink out of there. This is done. I got a question. What are the chances we could see a risk? Sports illustrated body issue. What I, you know, that is like with me like paint on the bathing suits of, oh, like a full body paint. Yeah, we did, we did that Basil. We did it one year at Basel. We did a bunch of body painting. you know, there's some guys out there that are amazing at that stuff. Yeah. Here's a really good question here, actually. no, Joan's being so into art. What kept you from completely blasting your body in ink? I feel like a lot of you guys aren't covered in ink. Yeah, well, you know, cartoon who I consider being one of the greatest tattoo artists in the world. he, you know, kind of a minute. His movement, everything was my roommate for years. Wow. So I was around. So it's like that thing you around so much stuff that you're not blasted. And that was your room. Yeah. My first tattoo I gave myself because I was, I was I was talking shit. I was like, that's not fucking art. That same painting. So you can't do it like I can do it. And I was all drunk in that. And luckily he took the ink out of the gun. I fucking blasted my head all kind of shit. And I would have had these knife. Look at her. Look at her face. I would have had these gnarly tattoos next. I just had scabs. Just. Yeah, but he didn't take that. He got that one and he should have. But, Yeah. And then, you know, these are all from me just fucking fidgeting and can't fucking stop touching myself. And then I have to. I haven't stopped drawing since he sat down. I'm going to cut that one out. And, so this is my daughter's names. yeah. It's just these are happy hour fidgets because we have a lot of tattoo artists on happy hours. Yeah, okay, I can draw that that. Are you still doing that? No, no, that was your podcast show we did during Covid, you know? Yeah. I mean, that's why we started. Yeah, yeah. Now it's like, you know, it was super easy to get people to come here to and cover. People wanted to find something new. And now it's just like things have geared back up. Everyone's pretty busy. We do them every once in a while. There's not scheduled. Yeah, that's how many. But you don't need to show the camera up there. But that's impressive. Yeah, the amount of alcohol. Yeah, that's surely a happy hour. Did Tito's sponsor it toward the end? Towards the end? Too late. I mean, no one do I. Tito's stock went up. Dude. Danny, any last questions before we it socks? But an hour ago was pretty quick. No just honored man. It's really cool. This is definitely like every kid's fantasy as far as like a studio. You know, it's funny. My daughter's been around spray paint so much, I'm like, let's go paint that. I. You have a brush. I'm like, what the fuck? Like, I get more control the brush. I mean, cause how much is like, the paint can evolve since you started? Oh, man. You know, we had, like, 12 colors, right? That's what we use now. There's like 500 colors made for me right there. Different pressures, 27 caps. We had two caps. We had in fact happened to ready. We have you know, it's fucking nuts. And what's the two. What can they make. Is there any mega cans. Yeah. I don't even know what the call. But the fucking big ass mega cans. Montana. I'm size for Montana. It's fine for them for over ten years. They're amazing. And they gave me this canvas time. They could catch tag on like a whole fucking building. Wow. It's crazy. All right, that's it. That's a wrap. Thank you. Dude, you're a legend. Thank you for having us over. Thank you, thank you, thank you, thank you. All right. That’s a wrap.